Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby jon22 » Sat Jan 25, 2014 5:48 pm

I'd prefer if X was reload and Y was switch weapons personally, but meh I'll get used to it. I do agree with the need of making friend and foe more obvious though. Maybe make it so your allies names are permanently above the heads of players in green, and when they move away from you a certain distance it goes see through but you can still see it when they are on the other side of the map, or a small green blip above their head. Enemies should have no name appear above their head inless you target them directly, or they are close to you, in red font. Players on the same team as me always try to kill me nearly everytime I play, which is really annoying.
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby BushKillFalls » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:35 pm

I agree and Disagree with things also Stated But I think they nailed 90% of the Interface. I think we might be getting away from the fact that DownGate is another Alpha like Xenominer. Granted, I think that Stability wise it is Further along in the first shot which was I believe the Point. Make Downgate using Xenominer as Template so they can Sure up Xenominers Code. The Nick and Nack stuff like More Maps and Button Layout are all a preference kind of thing rather than a right and wrong aspect.

I like the ability to scroll up and down in the menus rather than having to hit a to Start, B to Exit, and y or something to load because that requires me to memorize every menu in the game so I can remember what to hit when. I find myself even after all this time when I go into the Bot Menu constantly looking at the bottom of the screen to remember what button does what which isn't bad because that kind of menu interface works there.

The more I play the less fond of Y to Reload I become (Due to constantly switching weapons at the wrong time in battle :x ) and would also Prefer Y instead to be Weapon Switch and X to be Reload and Rearm when I Hold it on an Ammo Crate because I am essentially Reloading my Gun at the Ammo Crate. Plus, I don't know if anyone noticed, but when you Rearm at an Ammo Crate you can only pick up 2 clips worth if you are completely out of ammo unless you have at least 1 round in your reserve clip where in that case you can only reload your Primary Clip. It would be nice if that Second Clip would Refill Fully even if it is Partially Full like you can with your Primary Clip.

I believe when you do hit B your selection Saves even though there is a Save Option so that just might be Redundant. I can't remember Posatively but that in theory allows you to edit your Drone and Cancel without saving if it does work properly. I know that if you are Editing in a game Lobby and the Game kicks you back to the Lobby because time is running out than it does save your changes even if you are in the middle of choosing.

There does need to be a Cooling Period after a Death before choosing a New Drone. It doesn't need to be long, but I too LEAPED INTO BATTLE with a Pick :oops: instead of a Grenade Launcher on several occasions. Personally, I have always held the more you die the longer your respawn time should be made even if it is to Lessen the Teams Losses due to your Kamikaze attitude towards things that is making you have to respawn so much. But with that should come a 5-10 second Invincibility instead of Less than 5 seconds to Stop Spawn Camping.

GM I think Agreed, there needs to be a notation of what unlocks when so we know what we are working towards. And I think the Lobby Drone Edit is the Same as the Menu Manage Drones except you select which one you want to edit in the lobby vs. the Manager. So you can edit any Drone you want in the Lobby. Since there is a Timmer you can't take forever editing your Drone though if you are in a Lobby so if you need more Time you do have to go to the Menu and Drone Manager to make longer decisions unlike the Lobby where you say I want a Flamethrower vs. a Grenade Launcher on this Map.

The lower level Ranks do Suck but they Should. Maybe there should be a Average Rank associated with each player to group weaker new players first before mixing them with higher Rank players like some games do so they aren't so dominated when starting out, but I'll put my Marine up to any Engineer and his Grenade Launcher or Flamethrower. Because that is all they have. The Marine has a Larger Upgrade Path and when you get it out of the Lower Ranks it gets Strong Quick...

At 1st and to get the Game out I understand everyone getting dumped into the Random Multiplayer Lobby However, I do hope in future Updates a Friend Prefered Option will be available where if your Friends from your friends List are in Game then it will try and hook you up with them first and fill the Gaps with Randoms. I am not saying I need to be on my Friends Sides either :twisted: I'll Kill them Too!

As for the Left Button and Right Button the Right Button Changes Ammo Type and the Left Button Changes Grenade Type. Making that the Weapons Select would seriously mess things up I think.

I definitely think Negative Points should be awarded to Friendly Fire and Suicide. If you get more than 3 Friendly Kills in a row to separate the Killers from the Stupid Friends just running into the fray you should be automatically Kicked with a Negative Voice Over.

I find it Hard that people haven't picked up on one team is Red and one team is Blue but the Name Tag Idea isn't Bad. Your Team has Gamer Tags no matter the Distance so you can easily pick up on their Location and approximate elevation Above or Below you. Though Gamer Tags do appear on targets when in your crosshairs.

I am not bashing anyone else's Opinions and Janx gave the most points to speak on. I am just pointing out a lot of this comes down to preference and some to Function.

still crosshair wrote:Other than that some people think that the flamethrower is bugged when they find out it can kill them.

I sometimes Just Point Up and Stare in Amazement as the fames fall upon my Drone. 8-) Love the Flame and Chemical Throwers :twisted:
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby ARCLIGHT545 » Sun Jan 26, 2014 2:46 am

janx wrote:
Spoiler: show
Speaking of Yes Men, I finally got a chance to play it, and I have thoughts. Many of them.

Here's the good:

I had fun. it reminded me of Tribes: Aerial Assault on the PS2 with the jet pack combat and of Red Faction 2's destructible terrain. I've got a lengthy list of faults with the game, but I did play from after dinner to bed time. So the game kept my attention, despite the things that irked me.

Here's the bad:

Menu UI is harder to use
Grist and I have talked about this before and they know the menuing was weak on Xeno, and the same problem is here. I think I've identified the key factors to what bugs me about them.

Selected menu item is hard to differentiate. This is because the primary difference between a selected item is it is yellow instead of white. That's not obvious from 6 feet back on a couch. Most video games highlight the selected item in multiple ways, they make it bigger, a completely different color (background included). They also avoid using menus where controller buttons will do.

Binary choice menus that suffer from "not-obviously selected" syndrome confuse the crap out of me. I sit there second guessing whether I'm about to choose Yes or No. I don't have that problem in CoD because they tell me to press A to continue or B to cancel. The game options should be written for a game controller, not a Windows user with a mouse.

Don't put a Save button in the game settings menu. The user goes into options, makes a change, and hits B to back out, with selections saved right then and there.

Don't make me select a Drone right after dying by using the same controls I was just flailing madly on. Dying and respawning prompting is so instantaneous that my last action trying to avenge myself is moving the selection for what drone to select. Gimme a second. Throw up an intermediary screen that says "Bob killed me" with a count-down (lots of death match games have that delay). Then present me with a decision on which drone to re-spawn with so my final twitch isn't selecting the useless Marine when I need my Engineer.

General UI oddness

Give me the same drone edit screen in the game between matches as I get from the Manage Drones menu. I want to see how much XP I have. I couldn't tell from within the match.

Stop prompting me for what drive to save game files to. I should get this prompt once when I launch the game. Instead, I get it whenever I exit a match, and at other odd times.

Use left/right bumbers for navigating tab menus (like the team stats after a match). Bumpers are a natural fit for tab menu select. MC360 uses them somewhat, as does Elder Scrolls. It's nice and a good fit.

Default me to see MY team's final stats. It's weird seeing "Victory" on the screen and hearing "You Lose" in my ears. It's like having somebody shake their head No while saying Yes.

Use a Tab menu for selecting my drone to respawn. This means it would engage the bumpers like I advised before, and would be less likely to be flipped around by final death twitching I also mentioned above. Additionally, now you can show me the stats on the guy I am about to select.

Stop the phone-tag of trying to hook up with my friends in a match. Since we don't get control of what game lobby we join, if my friends are mid-match, I am stuck in a new lobby, and forced to play with other people. We then basically never get to play together. I'd rather see a list of active matches, with who is in each match, and the option to start my own lobby. I can then join the existing match (even if I'm stuck in a holding lobby while they finish their current match), so that when they finish, I can get in on the next match.

Need a mechanism to vote off team-killers. Hook it up to the Select button. Pick a player, vote to Kick. Once kicked, he can't rejoin the host's session.

Tell me the level and objectives/rules in a splash screen before the match where I can read it. My TV is 42" and 6' away from the couch. I can't read tiny print at the bottom of the lobby screen. If it weren't for Arclight or Bush, I wouldn't know what the mission was per match. Especially because it changes each match. Who the heck sends in soldiers without ensuring they have been briefed on the mission?

Game play and controls

Don't re-use X to change weapons I have with picking up weapons or refilling from an ammo crate. You can't believe how many times i swapped to my pistol because I didn't know to hold X longer to pick up a gun or refill from the crate. Use the Left bumper to change weapon, so X can be strictly for using an item right in front of us.

Friendly Fire isn't fun with jerks I can't kick out. I know Friendly Fire can be fun for people who are playing the game right. But I can't control who I play with, and getting team-killed on purpose and repeatedly by at least two players last night wasn't fun.

Rebalance the classes, because nobody's playing the Marine for a reason. The Marine out-right sucks in combat compared to the Engineer. At least at the low level I've seen. There's something wrong when the Engineer's weapon is more effective than the dedicated soldier's weapon. I expected to be at least on par with Halo's starter weapon. Instead, I go pew, pew, pew, reload, get ganked and have to start over. I doubt I killed ANYBODY with that pea-shooter.

Speed up the mining process so I can alter the map and get a timely tactical advantage. I had a plan on the crater map. To drill through the side wall of our spawn point, to come out of the side of the crate in a new position to have a new sniping spot where nobody would expect an attack. It took FOREVER. And naturally, I got ganked as soon as the last block was removed. The engineer class should be able to modify the environment more readily (and be less effective at combat than the marine).

Make identifying Friend or Foe more obvious. Yes, we know my gun barrel tells me what team I am on. yes, we know the armor is colored to what team they are on. I wasn't the only one who still couldn't actually identify the enemy until they were too close (because then they killed me and it was kind obvious). In CoD or Halo, it is more obvious to who the enemy is when playing. A, there's a name above my allies head. B. the armor color stands out at longer distances. It's dark in this game, and zooming little guys are hard to see their armor color as it currently stands until they are at close range. A side idea to this is to make everybody's gun Blue, and always color the enemy Red. If I change colors between matches, I may forget what team I'm on. Why not just train me to always kill Red. Consider it the Augmented Reality function of my combat suit giving me FoF augmentation. Heck, color my guys bright blue on the main viewer when they are in sight.

I'm going to go play the game some more. It was fun seeing the maps get blowed up. I kind of wish we had access to map damaging gear at level one, as the starter gun sucks awful fierce.



Leave it to Janx to be the absolute UN yes man :lol:

I was not sold on this project when GM first announced it. I believed they were wasting time that they could be using on XM. They said it would help XM, so I put the XNA membership I bought to help test XM to use to test DG. Initially I was less than impressed, but after some a few test releases I saw what I think they wanted everyone to see. A seriously fun game. Yes there are things that need to be smoothed out, some tuning needs done. This is a NEW release, have fun with it! This game has a lot of potential, it has MANY elements you will all recognize from XM and many new ones that will be coming to XM including the new radar. There are many new blocks in the game that will also be making the move over. Some are hidden so make sure you explore the maps. What everyone needs to do is have the same patience with this game that we have all had with XM. This game will get tuned, this game will be improved. There are some things I wish they would do, such as impementing a CoD style control scheme. Its probably the most recognized FPS control set up out right now. Can they do it? We'll have to see. There are some visual issues that probably need modified and Im sure that will happen in time. In its current form it is a game that can really show off what XM has to offer, without openly saying it(landscapes, textures, tools, weapons...etc). Last time I checked, Minecraft never offered anything like this. Im proud of GM for what they have been doing. They have refined XM's code and have found more memory that XM can use. They've given us new weapons that will be moving over and explosive ones to boot. All of this is going to really set XM apart. I was once a naysayer but now Im on board 100%.
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby janx » Mon Jan 27, 2014 4:01 pm

the important thing is, I finally beat runheim in a match of 2v2.
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby ARCLIGHT545 » Mon Jan 27, 2014 4:59 pm

Thats ALWAYS a good thing :)
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby BushKillFalls » Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:47 pm

Rule #1 in DownGate:

:twisted: Always pick up a Dead Devs Gun :lol:
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby still crosshair » Tue Jan 28, 2014 1:37 am

Well I watch a guy kill his only team member several times during a match. But he was not trying to team kill but just get kills. He thought his teammate was a enemy and several times thought the enemy was teammates. So that ID system is something that should be done sooner than later.
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby janx » Tue Jan 28, 2014 10:06 am

still crosshair wrote:Well I watch a guy kill his only team member several times during a match. But he was not trying to team kill but just get kills. He thought his teammate was a enemy and several times thought the enemy was teammates. So that ID system is something that should be done sooner than later.


Like I said, I'm not the only one who had trouble differentiating (and I was trying to be careful).

The color isn't really visible at longer ranges. It's not until I get much closer that I can see the detail on the armor to tell for sure. Otherwise, I see smail pixels of team color at medium range, that make me question "was that the enemy"

Putting the floating name tags over my allies is probably the most standard methodology, and it'll probably solve the problem (barring true team killers, which is a different problem)
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby BushKillFalls » Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:01 pm

I still don't get how it is that hard to recognize a Bright Red Guy from a Dark Blue Guy.

About 95% of all FPS games only differentiate Teams by the Guy in Green Fatigues with Brown Spots and the Guy in Brown Fatigues with Green Spots. (unless there are Aliens, Humans and Straight up Robots in it at the same time allowing shape to be an assistant in determining teams) These Teams are Completely Different Colors with Yellow Trim Colors being the only thing in common with the other. Not to mention you are Carrying around a Big Glowing Red or Blue Gun that also signifies which team you are on. Most Games everyone uses the same exact guns. Even Halo only had team color Differences to differentiate Teams and all you had to go on was a Blue Hand and a Red Suited Enemy. DownGate has a Blue Gun and a Red Enemy.

I think it has more to do with Players never having played a FPS before aside from some not being able to tell colors on their TV. Name 1 Game that Spawns you and the Enemy Right next to each other in a Deathmatch. They don't exist. The team Killing at Spawn is simply Griefers.

I think the Name Tag above players would also help but simply knowing someone's name isn't going to solve it. Knowing I killed Joe23 isn't going to let me know he was on my team. If it said Ally it would. Maybe in the Team Colors even to Emphasize which team you are on though it detracts from the realism of a fight.

There still shouldn't be a Name Tag on enemies, though saying Enemy next to their name when the Crosshair Figure Pops Up sounds alright. The point of there being no general Name Tags is to Increase Difficulty and Realism. When I go Paintballing I don't know where my teammates are because I see a big Floating name tag above them, but because we communicate a plan of attack or have Line of Sight. Just like the enemy can be standing 3 feet in front of my face and I might not see them because they are camouflaged behind boxes of in the bush making me vulnerable. Of course that is easier done if the enemy isn't in my Party Chat when last round he was on my team so being able to choose or a friends team preference would be nice to facilitate less confusion.

So far I'd say in about 85-90% of all Battles I have fought there has been no Confusion that I have seen as everyone rushes to the Goals and kills those in their paths and Friendly fire seems to be in most part accidental due to the use of Grenades, Grenade Launchers, and Rockets. Except those that go Idle and don't move, get completely lost in the caves, or just go exploring on the map probably looking for Ideas, Entrenched Positions, or are just a few Sandwiches short of a Picnic. Also, don't forget many players play in different ways like in all games. There are always people with No Clue, Alternate Agendas, or Bad Intentions.

I agree there are more ways to communicate further what team you are on but as a whole I don't see that there is a lot more that can be done without changing Gameplay.
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Re: Thoughts on DownGate: ExoDrone Wars

Postby still crosshair » Tue Jan 28, 2014 1:07 pm

BushKillFalls wrote: Not to mention you are Carrying around a Big Glowing Red or Blue Gun that also signifies which team you are on. Most Games everyone uses the same exact guns. Even Halo only had team color Differences to differentiate Teams and all you had to go on was a Blue Hand and a Red Suited Enemy. DownGate has a Blue Gun and a Red Enemy.


And I believe this is one of the big problems that leads to team killing. The fact that your gun tells you what team color your on in most cases. If you had people in your lobby that your remembered were on your team than its easy to find out what color team your on. But say you are in a lobby that says your alone or that its you vs one or two than mid match someone joins your team. As you said most games have the same guns for both teams. Meaning some people may not notice the color difference while playing. Another thing is they are not used to looking at their gun to figure out what their team color.
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